Welcome Guest!  [Log In]  [Sign Up]

Diplomaticcorp Discussion Forum

Current View: Recent Messages: dc279
(2nd 1648 Playtest)

Messages:


New Post
List of Topics
Recent Messages


Preview:


Compact
Brief
Full


Replies:


Hide All
Show All

- Lane   (Sep 30, 2010, 9:23 pm)
http://andreabernardi.com/44_3.html

[Reply]

- Lane   (Sep 30, 2010, 7:31 pm)
http://solekrams.com/44_3.html

[Reply]

- Lane   (Sep 29, 2010, 6:06 pm)
http://steliodibello.com/30602.html

[Reply]

- Lane   (Sep 29, 2010, 2:42 pm)
http://camillianiroma.org/46790.html

[Reply]

- Lane   (Sep 29, 2010, 1:22 am)
http://www.uxxo.it/67678.html

[Reply]

(dc279) Lane Sep 29, 02:42 pm
http://camillianiroma.org/46790.html
(dc279) Lane Sep 29, 06:06 pm
http://steliodibello.com/30602.html
(dc279) Lane Sep 30, 07:31 pm
http://solekrams.com/44_3.html
(dc279) Lane Sep 30, 09:23 pm
http://andreabernardi.com/44_3.html
1648 - txurce   (Aug 25, 2010, 4:44 pm)
Polish-Lithuanian EOG:
I chose Poland because I like the challenge of a central power, and liked its potential flexibility.  Perhaps the biggest flaw with 1648 is that it strongly steers Austria west, thereby dividing the map in half as in standard Dip.  Given that Poland has threats to the north, east and to some degree the south, it makes sense for them to establish neutrality at least.  I did this with the first Emperor, then set about creating an alliance that would thin out the east.  The Czar barely involved himself in the first winter negotiations, and so found himself the victim of a P/T/W blitz, and was basically out in two years.  This victory quickly gave me a near-corner position.

In the meantime, the course of the game was already being set by Spain.  The most powerful country at the start immediately allied with France - the strategist I feared most - then tried to draft Denmark vs England for a potentially unstoppable western wall.  This led me to forge a strong, mutually supportive alliance with Turkey, since a strong Ottoman entity was essential to controlling Franco-Spanish growth.

As the game progressed in the early years, Sweden stabbed Denmark, allowing England to quickly become a viable, seemingly neutral corner force.  My goal was to control the NE quadrant before pushing west.  As soon as Russia was gone I attacked Sweden with some Turkish help, and immediately started pushing him back.

In the meantime it became evident that the Austrian Emperor was playing gunboat style. Due to personal issues he engaged in no negotiations from his central position, and played that pretty poorly.  As a result France was making impressive gains in the center of the map.  Sweden's argument that I was better off attacking Austria instead of him, the better to stop F/S, haunted me a little.  Austria was so uncommunicative that even offering him blanket support drew no response.

At this point the game's opening fluidity turned to quickly hardening cement in the course of two years: 1652 and 1653.  In my opinion, there were four major factors, one following another in quick succession.

The first turning point came about due to Spain's conservative play.  Despite having an early edge on Turkey and only one place to go given his alliance - east across the Med - he failed to seize the initiative and take uncontested control of what was then his front yard, the Ionian Sea.  The Sultan, on the other hand, impressed me by meeting the challenge head-on, taking the Ionian in 1651 and the Adriatic in 1653 in a series of tactical victories.  From then on Spain was on the defensive with nowhere to go militarily.  In fact, had there been more room around the Ionian to maneuver, Turkey would have eventually broken through.  

The second turning point was the abdication of the Austrian emperor as 1652 began, once it was pointed out to him that it wouldn't cause any systemic problems.  The new emperor found himself land-locked and locked-in with five armies.  After a couple of years trying to establish his own way, he realized that his only hope to survive was as the central wall of an alliance with P/T.  It was a position that offered little else, but the emperor played it for what it was worth.  All of a sudden the French momentum slowed as well, and a hard line began to form from Brandenburg down to the Ionian.

The only fluidity in the game existed in the north, where I was making headway on Sweden and - much more importantly - England had seemingly yet to commit to any side while gobbling Denmark.  I engaged in extensive diplomacy with Cromwell, trying to recruit him to the eastern cause.  My basic argument was that he was in excellent position to have his uncontested fleets sweep down on France, whereas he couldn't hope to break through against me.  That he was as secure as anyone in his corner seemed to go without saying.  Our talks continued as he surprised me by attacking Sweden after Denmark, thereby encroaching on an areas I had assumed would soon be mine.  It didn't affect my desire to ally. until he then attacked me in Russia in 1653.

England told me he had chosen the west because his goal was to survive in a large draw, and he feared a Polish solo.  To have made such a conservative decision so early in the game was disappointing.  I immediately countered by offering the dying Sweden survival as a minor power, ceding his doomed eastern position in exchange for the hope of expanding in a joint thrust west through Scandinavia against England.  I was confident this diplomatic sally would work, but then the Swedish king suffered a serious injury, and had to abdicate.  I made his heir the same offer, but he didn't see the same inevitable fate that I did if he chose the west.  Choose the west he did, and these two factors - Sweden and England allying with F/S vs APT - finished the erection of the wall dividing Europe.

The conflict then entered its second phase, in which what little action there was consisted of England steadily shifting all his weight east in an effort to take Novgorod, while Sweden was predictably reduced year by year.  The English strategy didn't make sense to me, as his eastern thrust couldn't pay off in any meaningful way, while every season left him increasingly vulnerable to a French stab from a player known for rarely settling for a draw.  Even after England took Novgorod thanks to a debatable ruling, there was still no break in the P/T Russian line.

As soon as the new Swedish ruler chose the west, my diplomacy with France kicked into high gear.  As I had fully expected, the French king told me that there was no way he would settle for a DIAS.  Our plan was to have him strike E/S, after which I would roll up Scandinavia and Turkey would sweep west in the Med, pushing back Spain.  France waited longer than I would have to stab his allies.  I found myself both impatient and increasingly impressed by the benefits of France's patience.  With every passing season, England improbably became more exposed.  By the time France launched a well-timed strike in the fall of 1656, he had an outside shot at a solo.  

France came close to succeeding, but he didn't quite make it.  The game then entered its third and final phase.  Sweden died.  England fell back quickly across Scandinavia.  And Spain made a deal with Turkey where he would be left alone enough to inflict damage on France.  The result of all this was that by 1660, France's explosive growth had now led to some shrinkage, Turkey had Spain at his mercy, and I was on the verge of moving into the Atlantic.  I had long been committed to not stabbing Turkey by the time I had my inevitable window at a solo, because we had bailed each other out of enough jams to make this unpalatable to me.  After the decisive French initiative to break the stalemate, I was equally committed to an FPT draw.  

The situation then came to a head when the Spanish king declared that he would accept neither a PT nor FPT draw, and proceeded to start giving away enough of his centers to hand Turkey a solo.  No one with the upper hand ever likes these sorts of attempts by a doomed player to assert himself on an entire game, but they are usually depressingly effective.  Turkey told me he couldn't refuse such a huge gift horse.  I gave him my blessing, partly because he had been an excellent ally. and partly because I had already made contingency plans.

Rather than let Spain dictate an undesirable end to the game, I had maneuvered into a position where, from a distant 14, French cooperation would allow me to top Turkey's potential 19 with 20 in one turn.  However, our ultimate goal wasn't a Polish solo, but a three-way draw.  This required a last-minute diplomatic effort with Turkey, where France and I laid out how he should strive to reach 19 rather than 18, and how I would hold at 19, after which we would be tied and in position to dictate the outcome, however long it took.

Sustaining that would have been tricky, of course, but all the more fun for that.  The basic plan was to keep Turkey and Poland even while France steadily reduced Spain, until he either capitulated or was eliminated.  We coordinated everything, and the fall 1661 season came off with some surprises, but all the key parts falling into place.  One season later, the game ended with the three consistently successful powers on top.

This is my second game of 1648.  As I mentioned earlier, I think that the map steers Austria too hard to the west, and the Ionian bottleneck needs to be broken up.  In addition, Russia and Poland have a hard time not fighting early in the game.  In all this, 1648 is not as fluid as A&E.  But overall Charles has created an excellent variant that sustains repeated visits - the highest compliment one can give a designer. 

Jorge
2010/8/24 Mike Hoffman <mrh(at)panix.com>

Wonderful write-up Harvey!  I really enjoyed reading it.

I guess I'll follow up with my EOG, especially since there isn't much to say.

EOG -- Austria

The call came through the fog, with Trumpets blaring: "The Light Brigade is called to action".  I grabbed my sword, hopped on my trusty steed, and rode off to join in the fray.


Immediately, I was set upon by nearly all of the existing opponents.  Poland and Turkey, France and Spain, and a "Hi Hello" from England.  It was clear that 2 alliances had formed, and I was caught dead-center between them.  Instead of immediately picking sides, I waited to let one side prove untrustworthy and make

my decision for me.  Nigs grabbed that banner and ran with it.  So Jorge and I began discussions.

I have to admit that as a Light Brigade replacement, this game was not the top of my priorities.  And with Charles' very restrictive rules, I became more and more uncomfortable playing the game.  But a LB Knight does not shirk his responsibilities and I vowed to play out the position.  However, internally, I decided to let Jorge play "puppet master" -- a position I rarely take. 


The game progressed with me battling France for the interior, and me losing ground slowly but surely.  I figured it was only a matter of time before I was exiled from the board, and I offered my centers to Jorge and Adrian -- both declined and vowed to fight to keep me around.  This was a bit of a turning point -- a refocusing of attentions.  The board shifted, Spain began losing ground, and France lost some influence in the center. 


Then Adrian went silent. 

It became clear (well, Jorge pointed it out) that Spain was tossing the game to Turkey, leaving centers unprotected and allowing Adrian to scoop them up.  Jorge refocused his units to grab some of Turkey's centers to balance Turkey's gains and prevent the Solo.  I switched my attack to the Alps area, hitting France and Spain depending on who was nearby. 


To Adrian's credit, he never really came after me for easy centers.  He hit me once, but mostly blocked my ability to drive through to the Balkans.

Jorge kept his promise and kept my units alive as a buffer between Turkey and France.  And Nigs stopped attacking me, in order to focus on stopping Spain from giving everything away, or at least remove Spain and form our own stalemate line against Adrian.


Somewhere in this mix was a fiasco of grand extremes, dealing with missed deadlines and abandonments.  My record with DipCorp and Light Brigade is forever tarnished with an Abandonment (my first EVER in over 20 years of Dip).  Ah well, enough has been said on the subject, so that's all I'll say now.


Thanks to all of you for a fun game!  I have faced each of you in other games (this was a first for Harvey, but we met again in the Haven) and always enjoy our games together.  Such a high caliber group of players! 


Mike
---------
"Sit Long, Talk Much, Laugh Often" -- anon
"Shared Pain is lessened, Shared Joy is increased" --- Spider Robinson




On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 11:03 AM, Harvey Morris <hmtucaz(at)gmail.com> wrote:

About 10 days from now I head off for a holiday and won't be back home until the end of September.  I don't know if any else plans to do End of Game Statements, but I have one that I actually wrote almost three months ago.  It assumed that I would be eliminated, and at that time I had no real sense of who the winner (or winners) might be.




Below is what I wrote.  I have not altered it since then.

Best Wishes to All,
Harvey


END OF GAME STATEMENT - ENGLAND

Harvey - "It feels really great to
have won this game!"

Observer - "Hey, wait a minute. You
didn't win this game. In fact you were eliminated before the game
ended."

H - "Yes, I was eliminated but I
still won.

O - "What the heck are you saying?
--------- won the game.

H - "Oh, I see. They got their
scores improved. But, what does that have to do with winning?"

O - "It's pretty straightforward.
Haven't you even read the Diplomacy rules?"

H - "I understand your confusion.
You assume that all people play the game to beat the other players,
and that determines who wins and who loses. And you're right -
according to view, I didn't win. But that's not the metric I use."

O - "The metric you use? Oh come on!
Is this going to be a 'sour grapes' story?"

H - "I'll let you judge the 'grapes'
part of it. From my perspective, however, the scores on a web site
aren't very important to me. Far more important are the interactions
that I have with the other players. That's what determines whether
or not I've won a particular game. And, in this game I was a real
winner."

O - "By interactions do you mean you
look at your success in stabbing, misleading and outsmarting the
others?"

H - "Nope, not even close. Don't get
me wrong; I'm no saint, and I've done my share of devious stuff.
And, like everyone else I have no objection to eliminating others and
coming out ahead. But that's not winning for me. Instead I measure
my success or failure by the pleasure I gained from getting to know
my fellow players. And in this game I did pretty well. I got to
have a bunch of "off-line" email conversations with Dirk, along
with a couple of extended 'non-game" phone calls in an effort to
help him make some business connections. I got to have two meals
with Jorge in southern California, while there. I even got to
exchange thoughts about U.S. Immigrations issues and the new Arizona
law with Charles. Who would have thought that a German guy would
have such a keen understanding of U.S. politics and social policies?
On top of that, I got a bunch of supportive emails from all the
players when I went through my medical challenges. All that was far
more important to me than counting how many centers I had at any
given moment in the game."

O - "Fair enough, but what about the
game itself? Surely you gave it some thought as it progressed?"

H - "Jeez, do you really expect me to
remember that stuff? Well, I'll give it a try. Being England, and
starting with just two centers ..."

O - "How did you end up playing
England?"

H - "Oh, when the game started, I
told Charles that I didn't really care which power I got. When I got
England I realized that I needed to do some fancy footwork if I was
going to avoid being eliminated right away. (See, I do care about
the 'game proper' at some level.) My thought was to do what I could
to get Denmark and Sweden to attack each other, in order to give me
some breathing space. Even though I failed (they seemed determined
to be allies) I was able to pick up Ire and Sco. In large part that
was because I trusted France when he offered to make ENG a DMZ. In
many ways that set the stage for the rest of the game. I proclaimed
to the world that England was neutral, while all the while doing what
I could to aide the covert(?) FSE alliance. As things progressed,
France and Spain were very active in trying to coordinate their
forces in the battle for central and southern Europe. I did my best
to stay out of trouble, and continue the charade of my neutrality."

O - "Do you really think you were
able to fool people on that one?"

H - "For a while I think it worked.
Eventually it must have become clear to Jorge that my 'northern
advancement' was aimed at flanking PTA. In any case I'm sure that he
became increasingly frustrated with me as the game advanced. He kept
urging me to attack France, warning that if I did not France would
eventually attack me. Although I wasn't certain that I would
eventually face a French stab, it did seem likely. However, I chose
to not stab France. I thought that to do so would only benefit
Poland, and that I would be caught in a vise, attacked by both France
and Poland. I wasn't sure whether Nigs would honor our alliance, but
I felt that however slight the possibility, it was a better outcome
than the otherwise certainty of being sandwiched between Poland and
France."

O - "And once the stab did come, did
you have regrets about not stabbing first?"

H - "Not for a moment. My only
regret was that I was going to have to eventually deal with Jorge's
'told you so' comments. By the way, to his real credit he said not a
word about it at our dinner in Los Angeles. As a side note, the
highlight of the meal came almost at the end when a brief discussion
of Diplomacy did come up. Catie, Jorge's most impressive girlfriend,
suddenly realized the Diplomacy connection and said, 'Oh, you're that
Harvey!'. I'm still not sure whether I should have been ashamed or
proud to have been identified."

O - "You can't really tell me that
you have no negative feelings about Nigs' stab?"

H - "I really don't. First, I was
expecting it and was surprised that it didn't come a bit sooner.
More importantly, however, was the offer that Nigs had made before I
went into the hospital for my cardiac procedure. There was a vote
for a DIAS on the table, and both Nigs and Dirk offered to vote for
it in order to end the game and 'spare me' from having to think about
the situation while dealing with medical issues. I thanked them, but
asked them to not vote for the DIAS, and I voted against it."

O - "So, no regrets at all?"

H - "A few. First, that I didn't
really establish relationships with the other players. More
importantly, there were several points in the last three or four
months when I found myself (very uncharacteristically) depressed due
to my medical situation. The impact was that I lost virtually all
interest in the game, and lacked the energy to even force myself to
be an active participant in the game. That was unfair to the rest of
the players. I'm most grateful, however, for the support that got
from everyone, Charles included."

O - "And now?"

H - "If truth be told, I'm going to
'hang up my rock and roll shoes' for a while and take a hiatus from
playing Diplomacy. I don't know if it will be weeks or months. It's
happened before - after a year or two playing multiple games
simultaneously I get burned out. But sooner or later the itch comes
back. I'm sure it will again. In the meantime, many thanks to all -
for the challenge, for the support, for the encouragement and for the
friendship!"

[Reply]

1648 - offdisc   (Aug 24, 2010, 3:10 pm)
Wonderful write-up Harvey!  I really enjoyed reading it.

I guess I'll follow up with my EOG, especially since there isn't much to say.

EOG -- Austria

The call came through the fog, with Trumpets blaring: "The Light Brigade is called to action".  I grabbed my sword, hopped on my trusty steed, and rode off to join in the fray.


Immediately, I was set upon by nearly all of the existing opponents.  Poland and Turkey, France and Spain, and a "Hi Hello" from England.  It was clear that 2 alliances had formed, and I was caught dead-center between them.  Instead of immediately picking sides, I waited to let one side prove untrustworthy and make

my decision for me.  Nigs grabbed that banner and ran with it.  So Jorge and I began discussions.

I have to admit that as a Light Brigade replacement, this game was not the top of my priorities.  And with Charles' very restrictive rules, I became more and more uncomfortable playing the game.  But a LB Knight does not shirk his responsibilities and I vowed to play out the position.  However, internally, I decided to let Jorge play "puppet master" -- a position I rarely take. 


The game progressed with me battling France for the interior, and me losing ground slowly but surely.  I figured it was only a matter of time before I was exiled from the board, and I offered my centers to Jorge and Adrian -- both declined and vowed to fight to keep me around.  This was a bit of a turning point -- a refocusing of attentions.  The board shifted, Spain began losing ground, and France lost some influence in the center. 


Then Adrian went silent. 

It became clear (well, Jorge pointed it out) that Spain was tossing the game to Turkey, leaving centers unprotected and allowing Adrian to scoop them up.  Jorge refocused his units to grab some of Turkey's centers to balance Turkey's gains and prevent the Solo.  I switched my attack to the Alps area, hitting France and Spain depending on who was nearby. 


To Adrian's credit, he never really came after me for easy centers.  He hit me once, but mostly blocked my ability to drive through to the Balkans.

Jorge kept his promise and kept my units alive as a buffer between Turkey and France.  And Nigs stopped attacking me, in order to focus on stopping Spain from giving everything away, or at least remove Spain and form our own stalemate line against Adrian.


Somewhere in this mix was a fiasco of grand extremes, dealing with missed deadlines and abandonments.  My record with DipCorp and Light Brigade is forever tarnished with an Abandonment (my first EVER in over 20 years of Dip).  Ah well, enough has been said on the subject, so that's all I'll say now.


Thanks to all of you for a fun game!  I have faced each of you in other games (this was a first for Harvey, but we met again in the Haven) and always enjoy our games together.  Such a high caliber group of players! 


Mike
---------
"Sit Long, Talk Much, Laugh Often" -- anon
"Shared Pain is lessened, Shared Joy is increased" --- Spider Robinson




On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 11:03 AM, Harvey Morris <hmtucaz(at)gmail.com> wrote:

About 10 days from now I head off for a holiday and won't be back home until the end of September.  I don't know if any else plans to do End of Game Statements, but I have one that I actually wrote almost three months ago.  It assumed that I would be eliminated, and at that time I had no real sense of who the winner (or winners) might be.



Below is what I wrote.  I have not altered it since then.

Best Wishes to All,
Harvey


END OF GAME STATEMENT - ENGLAND

Harvey - "It feels really great to
have won this game!"

Observer - "Hey, wait a minute. You
didn't win this game. In fact you were eliminated before the game
ended."

H - "Yes, I was eliminated but I
still won.

O - "What the heck are you saying?
--------- won the game.

H - "Oh, I see. They got their
scores improved. But, what does that have to do with winning?"

O - "It's pretty straightforward.
Haven't you even read the Diplomacy rules?"

H - "I understand your confusion.
You assume that all people play the game to beat the other players,
and that determines who wins and who loses. And you're right -
according to view, I didn't win. But that's not the metric I use."

O - "The metric you use? Oh come on!
Is this going to be a 'sour grapes' story?"

H - "I'll let you judge the 'grapes'
part of it. From my perspective, however, the scores on a web site
aren't very important to me. Far more important are the interactions
that I have with the other players. That's what determines whether
or not I've won a particular game. And, in this game I was a real
winner."

O - "By interactions do you mean you
look at your success in stabbing, misleading and outsmarting the
others?"

H - "Nope, not even close. Don't get
me wrong; I'm no saint, and I've done my share of devious stuff.
And, like everyone else I have no objection to eliminating others and
coming out ahead. But that's not winning for me. Instead I measure
my success or failure by the pleasure I gained from getting to know
my fellow players. And in this game I did pretty well. I got to
have a bunch of "off-line" email conversations with Dirk, along
with a couple of extended 'non-game" phone calls in an effort to
help him make some business connections. I got to have two meals
with Jorge in southern California, while there. I even got to
exchange thoughts about U.S. Immigrations issues and the new Arizona
law with Charles. Who would have thought that a German guy would
have such a keen understanding of U.S. politics and social policies?
On top of that, I got a bunch of supportive emails from all the
players when I went through my medical challenges. All that was far
more important to me than counting how many centers I had at any
given moment in the game."

O - "Fair enough, but what about the
game itself? Surely you gave it some thought as it progressed?"

H - "Jeez, do you really expect me to
remember that stuff? Well, I'll give it a try. Being England, and
starting with just two centers ..."

O - "How did you end up playing
England?"

H - "Oh, when the game started, I
told Charles that I didn't really care which power I got. When I got
England I realized that I needed to do some fancy footwork if I was
going to avoid being eliminated right away. (See, I do care about
the 'game proper' at some level.) My thought was to do what I could
to get Denmark and Sweden to attack each other, in order to give me
some breathing space. Even though I failed (they seemed determined
to be allies) I was able to pick up Ire and Sco. In large part that
was because I trusted France when he offered to make ENG a DMZ. In
many ways that set the stage for the rest of the game. I proclaimed
to the world that England was neutral, while all the while doing what
I could to aide the covert(?) FSE alliance. As things progressed,
France and Spain were very active in trying to coordinate their
forces in the battle for central and southern Europe. I did my best
to stay out of trouble, and continue the charade of my neutrality."

O - "Do you really think you were
able to fool people on that one?"

H - "For a while I think it worked.
Eventually it must have become clear to Jorge that my 'northern
advancement' was aimed at flanking PTA. In any case I'm sure that he
became increasingly frustrated with me as the game advanced. He kept
urging me to attack France, warning that if I did not France would
eventually attack me. Although I wasn't certain that I would
eventually face a French stab, it did seem likely. However, I chose
to not stab France. I thought that to do so would only benefit
Poland, and that I would be caught in a vise, attacked by both France
and Poland. I wasn't sure whether Nigs would honor our alliance, but
I felt that however slight the possibility, it was a better outcome
than the otherwise certainty of being sandwiched between Poland and
France."

O - "And once the stab did come, did
you have regrets about not stabbing first?"

H - "Not for a moment. My only
regret was that I was going to have to eventually deal with Jorge's
'told you so' comments. By the way, to his real credit he said not a
word about it at our dinner in Los Angeles. As a side note, the
highlight of the meal came almost at the end when a brief discussion
of Diplomacy did come up. Catie, Jorge's most impressive girlfriend,
suddenly realized the Diplomacy connection and said, 'Oh, you're that
Harvey!'. I'm still not sure whether I should have been ashamed or
proud to have been identified."

O - "You can't really tell me that
you have no negative feelings about Nigs' stab?"

H - "I really don't. First, I was
expecting it and was surprised that it didn't come a bit sooner.
More importantly, however, was the offer that Nigs had made before I
went into the hospital for my cardiac procedure. There was a vote
for a DIAS on the table, and both Nigs and Dirk offered to vote for
it in order to end the game and 'spare me' from having to think about
the situation while dealing with medical issues. I thanked them, but
asked them to not vote for the DIAS, and I voted against it."

O - "So, no regrets at all?"

H - "A few. First, that I didn't
really establish relationships with the other players. More
importantly, there were several points in the last three or four
months when I found myself (very uncharacteristically) depressed due
to my medical situation. The impact was that I lost virtually all
interest in the game, and lacked the energy to even force myself to
be an active participant in the game. That was unfair to the rest of
the players. I'm most grateful, however, for the support that got
from everyone, Charles included."

O - "And now?"

H - "If truth be told, I'm going to
'hang up my rock and roll shoes' for a while and take a hiatus from
playing Diplomacy. I don't know if it will be weeks or months. It's
happened before - after a year or two playing multiple games
simultaneously I get burned out. But sooner or later the itch comes
back. I'm sure it will again. In the meantime, many thanks to all -
for the challenge, for the support, for the encouragement and for the
friendship!"

[Reply]

1648 091010: Game Over - charlesf   (Aug 24, 2010, 2:32 pm)
Hi guys,
 
as I've not been home of late owing to family
matters, I owe you an official statement that the FPT tree-way draw proposal has
met universal approval. The game thus has ended and there will be no Fall
adjucation.
 
I'd like to congratulate all players for seeing it
out until the very end.
 
Charles
 
 

[Reply]

1648 (dc279) offdisc Aug 24, 03:10 pm
Wonderful write-up Harvey!  I really enjoyed reading it.

I guess I'll follow up with my EOG, especially since there isn't much to say.

EOG -- Austria

The call came through the fog, with Trumpets blaring: "The Light Brigade is called to action".  I grabbed my sword, hopped on my trusty steed, and rode off to join in the fray.


Immediately, I was set upon by nearly all of the existing opponents.  Poland and Turkey, France and Spain, and a "Hi Hello" from England.  It was clear that 2 alliances had formed, and I was caught dead-center between them.  Instead of immediately picking sides, I waited to let one side prove untrustworthy and make

my decision for me.  Nigs grabbed that banner and ran with it.  So Jorge and I began discussions.

I have to admit that as a Light Brigade replacement, this game was not the top of my priorities.  And with Charles' very restrictive rules, I became more and more uncomfortable playing the game.  But a LB Knight does not shirk his responsibilities and I vowed to play out the position.  However, internally, I decided to let Jorge play "puppet master" -- a position I rarely take. 


The game progressed with me battling France for the interior, and me losing ground slowly but surely.  I figured it was only a matter of time before I was exiled from the board, and I offered my centers to Jorge and Adrian -- both declined and vowed to fight to keep me around.  This was a bit of a turning point -- a refocusing of attentions.  The board shifted, Spain began losing ground, and France lost some influence in the center. 


Then Adrian went silent. 

It became clear (well, Jorge pointed it out) that Spain was tossing the game to Turkey, leaving centers unprotected and allowing Adrian to scoop them up.  Jorge refocused his units to grab some of Turkey's centers to balance Turkey's gains and prevent the Solo.  I switched my attack to the Alps area, hitting France and Spain depending on who was nearby. 


To Adrian's credit, he never really came after me for easy centers.  He hit me once, but mostly blocked my ability to drive through to the Balkans.

Jorge kept his promise and kept my units alive as a buffer between Turkey and France.  And Nigs stopped attacking me, in order to focus on stopping Spain from giving everything away, or at least remove Spain and form our own stalemate line against Adrian.


Somewhere in this mix was a fiasco of grand extremes, dealing with missed deadlines and abandonments.  My record with DipCorp and Light Brigade is forever tarnished with an Abandonment (my first EVER in over 20 years of Dip).  Ah well, enough has been said on the subject, so that's all I'll say now.


Thanks to all of you for a fun game!  I have faced each of you in other games (this was a first for Harvey, but we met again in the Haven) and always enjoy our games together.  Such a high caliber group of players! 


Mike
---------
"Sit Long, Talk Much, Laugh Often" -- anon
"Shared Pain is lessened, Shared Joy is increased" --- Spider Robinson




On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 11:03 AM, Harvey Morris <hmtucaz(at)gmail.com> wrote:

About 10 days from now I head off for a holiday and won't be back home until the end of September.  I don't know if any else plans to do End of Game Statements, but I have one that I actually wrote almost three months ago.  It assumed that I would be eliminated, and at that time I had no real sense of who the winner (or winners) might be.



Below is what I wrote.  I have not altered it since then.

Best Wishes to All,
Harvey


END OF GAME STATEMENT - ENGLAND

Harvey - "It feels really great to
have won this game!"

Observer - "Hey, wait a minute. You
didn't win this game. In fact you were eliminated before the game
ended."

H - "Yes, I was eliminated but I
still won.

O - "What the heck are you saying?
--------- won the game.

H - "Oh, I see. They got their
scores improved. But, what does that have to do with winning?"

O - "It's pretty straightforward.
Haven't you even read the Diplomacy rules?"

H - "I understand your confusion.
You assume that all people play the game to beat the other players,
and that determines who wins and who loses. And you're right -
according to view, I didn't win. But that's not the metric I use."

O - "The metric you use? Oh come on!
Is this going to be a 'sour grapes' story?"

H - "I'll let you judge the 'grapes'
part of it. From my perspective, however, the scores on a web site
aren't very important to me. Far more important are the interactions
that I have with the other players. That's what determines whether
or not I've won a particular game. And, in this game I was a real
winner."

O - "By interactions do you mean you
look at your success in stabbing, misleading and outsmarting the
others?"

H - "Nope, not even close. Don't get
me wrong; I'm no saint, and I've done my share of devious stuff.
And, like everyone else I have no objection to eliminating others and
coming out ahead. But that's not winning for me. Instead I measure
my success or failure by the pleasure I gained from getting to know
my fellow players. And in this game I did pretty well. I got to
have a bunch of "off-line" email conversations with Dirk, along
with a couple of extended 'non-game" phone calls in an effort to
help him make some business connections. I got to have two meals
with Jorge in southern California, while there. I even got to
exchange thoughts about U.S. Immigrations issues and the new Arizona
law with Charles. Who would have thought that a German guy would
have such a keen understanding of U.S. politics and social policies?
On top of that, I got a bunch of supportive emails from all the
players when I went through my medical challenges. All that was far
more important to me than counting how many centers I had at any
given moment in the game."

O - "Fair enough, but what about the
game itself? Surely you gave it some thought as it progressed?"

H - "Jeez, do you really expect me to
remember that stuff? Well, I'll give it a try. Being England, and
starting with just two centers ..."

O - "How did you end up playing
England?"

H - "Oh, when the game started, I
told Charles that I didn't really care which power I got. When I got
England I realized that I needed to do some fancy footwork if I was
going to avoid being eliminated right away. (See, I do care about
the 'game proper' at some level.) My thought was to do what I could
to get Denmark and Sweden to attack each other, in order to give me
some breathing space. Even though I failed (they seemed determined
to be allies) I was able to pick up Ire and Sco. In large part that
was because I trusted France when he offered to make ENG a DMZ. In
many ways that set the stage for the rest of the game. I proclaimed
to the world that England was neutral, while all the while doing what
I could to aide the covert(?) FSE alliance. As things progressed,
France and Spain were very active in trying to coordinate their
forces in the battle for central and southern Europe. I did my best
to stay out of trouble, and continue the charade of my neutrality."

O - "Do you really think you were
able to fool people on that one?"

H - "For a while I think it worked.
Eventually it must have become clear to Jorge that my 'northern
advancement' was aimed at flanking PTA. In any case I'm sure that he
became increasingly frustrated with me as the game advanced. He kept
urging me to attack France, warning that if I did not France would
eventually attack me. Although I wasn't certain that I would
eventually face a French stab, it did seem likely. However, I chose
to not stab France. I thought that to do so would only benefit
Poland, and that I would be caught in a vise, attacked by both France
and Poland. I wasn't sure whether Nigs would honor our alliance, but
I felt that however slight the possibility, it was a better outcome
than the otherwise certainty of being sandwiched between Poland and
France."

O - "And once the stab did come, did
you have regrets about not stabbing first?"

H - "Not for a moment. My only
regret was that I was going to have to eventually deal with Jorge's
'told you so' comments. By the way, to his real credit he said not a
word about it at our dinner in Los Angeles. As a side note, the
highlight of the meal came almost at the end when a brief discussion
of Diplomacy did come up. Catie, Jorge's most impressive girlfriend,
suddenly realized the Diplomacy connection and said, 'Oh, you're that
Harvey!'. I'm still not sure whether I should have been ashamed or
proud to have been identified."

O - "You can't really tell me that
you have no negative feelings about Nigs' stab?"

H - "I really don't. First, I was
expecting it and was surprised that it didn't come a bit sooner.
More importantly, however, was the offer that Nigs had made before I
went into the hospital for my cardiac procedure. There was a vote
for a DIAS on the table, and both Nigs and Dirk offered to vote for
it in order to end the game and 'spare me' from having to think about
the situation while dealing with medical issues. I thanked them, but
asked them to not vote for the DIAS, and I voted against it."

O - "So, no regrets at all?"

H - "A few. First, that I didn't
really establish relationships with the other players. More
importantly, there were several points in the last three or four
months when I found myself (very uncharacteristically) depressed due
to my medical situation. The impact was that I lost virtually all
interest in the game, and lacked the energy to even force myself to
be an active participant in the game. That was unfair to the rest of
the players. I'm most grateful, however, for the support that got
from everyone, Charles included."

O - "And now?"

H - "If truth be told, I'm going to
'hang up my rock and roll shoes' for a while and take a hiatus from
playing Diplomacy. I don't know if it will be weeks or months. It's
happened before - after a year or two playing multiple games
simultaneously I get burned out. But sooner or later the itch comes
back. I'm sure it will again. In the meantime, many thanks to all -
for the challenge, for the support, for the encouragement and for the
friendship!"
1648 (dc279) txurce Aug 25, 04:44 pm
Polish-Lithuanian EOG:
I chose Poland because I like the challenge of a central power, and liked its potential flexibility.  Perhaps the biggest flaw with 1648 is that it strongly steers Austria west, thereby dividing the map in half as in standard Dip.  Given that Poland has threats to the north, east and to some degree the south, it makes sense for them to establish neutrality at least.  I did this with the first Emperor, then set about creating an alliance that would thin out the east.  The Czar barely involved himself in the first winter negotiations, and so found himself the victim of a P/T/W blitz, and was basically out in two years.  This victory quickly gave me a near-corner position.

In the meantime, the course of the game was already being set by Spain.  The most powerful country at the start immediately allied with France - the strategist I feared most - then tried to draft Denmark vs England for a potentially unstoppable western wall.  This led me to forge a strong, mutually supportive alliance with Turkey, since a strong Ottoman entity was essential to controlling Franco-Spanish growth.

As the game progressed in the early years, Sweden stabbed Denmark, allowing England to quickly become a viable, seemingly neutral corner force.  My goal was to control the NE quadrant before pushing west.  As soon as Russia was gone I attacked Sweden with some Turkish help, and immediately started pushing him back.

In the meantime it became evident that the Austrian Emperor was playing gunboat style. Due to personal issues he engaged in no negotiations from his central position, and played that pretty poorly.  As a result France was making impressive gains in the center of the map.  Sweden's argument that I was better off attacking Austria instead of him, the better to stop F/S, haunted me a little.  Austria was so uncommunicative that even offering him blanket support drew no response.

At this point the game's opening fluidity turned to quickly hardening cement in the course of two years: 1652 and 1653.  In my opinion, there were four major factors, one following another in quick succession.

The first turning point came about due to Spain's conservative play.  Despite having an early edge on Turkey and only one place to go given his alliance - east across the Med - he failed to seize the initiative and take uncontested control of what was then his front yard, the Ionian Sea.  The Sultan, on the other hand, impressed me by meeting the challenge head-on, taking the Ionian in 1651 and the Adriatic in 1653 in a series of tactical victories.  From then on Spain was on the defensive with nowhere to go militarily.  In fact, had there been more room around the Ionian to maneuver, Turkey would have eventually broken through.  

The second turning point was the abdication of the Austrian emperor as 1652 began, once it was pointed out to him that it wouldn't cause any systemic problems.  The new emperor found himself land-locked and locked-in with five armies.  After a couple of years trying to establish his own way, he realized that his only hope to survive was as the central wall of an alliance with P/T.  It was a position that offered little else, but the emperor played it for what it was worth.  All of a sudden the French momentum slowed as well, and a hard line began to form from Brandenburg down to the Ionian.

The only fluidity in the game existed in the north, where I was making headway on Sweden and - much more importantly - England had seemingly yet to commit to any side while gobbling Denmark.  I engaged in extensive diplomacy with Cromwell, trying to recruit him to the eastern cause.  My basic argument was that he was in excellent position to have his uncontested fleets sweep down on France, whereas he couldn't hope to break through against me.  That he was as secure as anyone in his corner seemed to go without saying.  Our talks continued as he surprised me by attacking Sweden after Denmark, thereby encroaching on an areas I had assumed would soon be mine.  It didn't affect my desire to ally. until he then attacked me in Russia in 1653.

England told me he had chosen the west because his goal was to survive in a large draw, and he feared a Polish solo.  To have made such a conservative decision so early in the game was disappointing.  I immediately countered by offering the dying Sweden survival as a minor power, ceding his doomed eastern position in exchange for the hope of expanding in a joint thrust west through Scandinavia against England.  I was confident this diplomatic sally would work, but then the Swedish king suffered a serious injury, and had to abdicate.  I made his heir the same offer, but he didn't see the same inevitable fate that I did if he chose the west.  Choose the west he did, and these two factors - Sweden and England allying with F/S vs APT - finished the erection of the wall dividing Europe.

The conflict then entered its second phase, in which what little action there was consisted of England steadily shifting all his weight east in an effort to take Novgorod, while Sweden was predictably reduced year by year.  The English strategy didn't make sense to me, as his eastern thrust couldn't pay off in any meaningful way, while every season left him increasingly vulnerable to a French stab from a player known for rarely settling for a draw.  Even after England took Novgorod thanks to a debatable ruling, there was still no break in the P/T Russian line.

As soon as the new Swedish ruler chose the west, my diplomacy with France kicked into high gear.  As I had fully expected, the French king told me that there was no way he would settle for a DIAS.  Our plan was to have him strike E/S, after which I would roll up Scandinavia and Turkey would sweep west in the Med, pushing back Spain.  France waited longer than I would have to stab his allies.  I found myself both impatient and increasingly impressed by the benefits of France's patience.  With every passing season, England improbably became more exposed.  By the time France launched a well-timed strike in the fall of 1656, he had an outside shot at a solo.  

France came close to succeeding, but he didn't quite make it.  The game then entered its third and final phase.  Sweden died.  England fell back quickly across Scandinavia.  And Spain made a deal with Turkey where he would be left alone enough to inflict damage on France.  The result of all this was that by 1660, France's explosive growth had now led to some shrinkage, Turkey had Spain at his mercy, and I was on the verge of moving into the Atlantic.  I had long been committed to not stabbing Turkey by the time I had my inevitable window at a solo, because we had bailed each other out of enough jams to make this unpalatable to me.  After the decisive French initiative to break the stalemate, I was equally committed to an FPT draw.  

The situation then came to a head when the Spanish king declared that he would accept neither a PT nor FPT draw, and proceeded to start giving away enough of his centers to hand Turkey a solo.  No one with the upper hand ever likes these sorts of attempts by a doomed player to assert himself on an entire game, but they are usually depressingly effective.  Turkey told me he couldn't refuse such a huge gift horse.  I gave him my blessing, partly because he had been an excellent ally. and partly because I had already made contingency plans.

Rather than let Spain dictate an undesirable end to the game, I had maneuvered into a position where, from a distant 14, French cooperation would allow me to top Turkey's potential 19 with 20 in one turn.  However, our ultimate goal wasn't a Polish solo, but a three-way draw.  This required a last-minute diplomatic effort with Turkey, where France and I laid out how he should strive to reach 19 rather than 18, and how I would hold at 19, after which we would be tied and in position to dictate the outcome, however long it took.

Sustaining that would have been tricky, of course, but all the more fun for that.  The basic plan was to keep Turkey and Poland even while France steadily reduced Spain, until he either capitulated or was eliminated.  We coordinated everything, and the fall 1661 season came off with some surprises, but all the key parts falling into place.  One season later, the game ended with the three consistently successful powers on top.

This is my second game of 1648.  As I mentioned earlier, I think that the map steers Austria too hard to the west, and the Ionian bottleneck needs to be broken up.  In addition, Russia and Poland have a hard time not fighting early in the game.  In all this, 1648 is not as fluid as A&E.  But overall Charles has created an excellent variant that sustains repeated visits - the highest compliment one can give a designer. 

Jorge
2010/8/24 Mike Hoffman <mrh(at)panix.com>

Wonderful write-up Harvey!  I really enjoyed reading it.

I guess I'll follow up with my EOG, especially since there isn't much to say.

EOG -- Austria

The call came through the fog, with Trumpets blaring: "The Light Brigade is called to action".  I grabbed my sword, hopped on my trusty steed, and rode off to join in the fray.


Immediately, I was set upon by nearly all of the existing opponents.  Poland and Turkey, France and Spain, and a "Hi Hello" from England.  It was clear that 2 alliances had formed, and I was caught dead-center between them.  Instead of immediately picking sides, I waited to let one side prove untrustworthy and make

my decision for me.  Nigs grabbed that banner and ran with it.  So Jorge and I began discussions.

I have to admit that as a Light Brigade replacement, this game was not the top of my priorities.  And with Charles' very restrictive rules, I became more and more uncomfortable playing the game.  But a LB Knight does not shirk his responsibilities and I vowed to play out the position.  However, internally, I decided to let Jorge play "puppet master" -- a position I rarely take. 


The game progressed with me battling France for the interior, and me losing ground slowly but surely.  I figured it was only a matter of time before I was exiled from the board, and I offered my centers to Jorge and Adrian -- both declined and vowed to fight to keep me around.  This was a bit of a turning point -- a refocusing of attentions.  The board shifted, Spain began losing ground, and France lost some influence in the center. 


Then Adrian went silent. 

It became clear (well, Jorge pointed it out) that Spain was tossing the game to Turkey, leaving centers unprotected and allowing Adrian to scoop them up.  Jorge refocused his units to grab some of Turkey's centers to balance Turkey's gains and prevent the Solo.  I switched my attack to the Alps area, hitting France and Spain depending on who was nearby. 


To Adrian's credit, he never really came after me for easy centers.  He hit me once, but mostly blocked my ability to drive through to the Balkans.

Jorge kept his promise and kept my units alive as a buffer between Turkey and France.  And Nigs stopped attacking me, in order to focus on stopping Spain from giving everything away, or at least remove Spain and form our own stalemate line against Adrian.


Somewhere in this mix was a fiasco of grand extremes, dealing with missed deadlines and abandonments.  My record with DipCorp and Light Brigade is forever tarnished with an Abandonment (my first EVER in over 20 years of Dip).  Ah well, enough has been said on the subject, so that's all I'll say now.


Thanks to all of you for a fun game!  I have faced each of you in other games (this was a first for Harvey, but we met again in the Haven) and always enjoy our games together.  Such a high caliber group of players! 


Mike
---------
"Sit Long, Talk Much, Laugh Often" -- anon
"Shared Pain is lessened, Shared Joy is increased" --- Spider Robinson




On Tue, Aug 24, 2010 at 11:03 AM, Harvey Morris <hmtucaz(at)gmail.com> wrote:

About 10 days from now I head off for a holiday and won't be back home until the end of September.  I don't know if any else plans to do End of Game Statements, but I have one that I actually wrote almost three months ago.  It assumed that I would be eliminated, and at that time I had no real sense of who the winner (or winners) might be.




Below is what I wrote.  I have not altered it since then.

Best Wishes to All,
Harvey


END OF GAME STATEMENT - ENGLAND

Harvey - "It feels really great to
have won this game!"

Observer - "Hey, wait a minute. You
didn't win this game. In fact you were eliminated before the game
ended."

H - "Yes, I was eliminated but I
still won.

O - "What the heck are you saying?
--------- won the game.

H - "Oh, I see. They got their
scores improved. But, what does that have to do with winning?"

O - "It's pretty straightforward.
Haven't you even read the Diplomacy rules?"

H - "I understand your confusion.
You assume that all people play the game to beat the other players,
and that determines who wins and who loses. And you're right -
according to view, I didn't win. But that's not the metric I use."

O - "The metric you use? Oh come on!
Is this going to be a 'sour grapes' story?"

H - "I'll let you judge the 'grapes'
part of it. From my perspective, however, the scores on a web site
aren't very important to me. Far more important are the interactions
that I have with the other players. That's what determines whether
or not I've won a particular game. And, in this game I was a real
winner."

O - "By interactions do you mean you
look at your success in stabbing, misleading and outsmarting the
others?"

H - "Nope, not even close. Don't get
me wrong; I'm no saint, and I've done my share of devious stuff.
And, like everyone else I have no objection to eliminating others and
coming out ahead. But that's not winning for me. Instead I measure
my success or failure by the pleasure I gained from getting to know
my fellow players. And in this game I did pretty well. I got to
have a bunch of "off-line" email conversations with Dirk, along
with a couple of extended 'non-game" phone calls in an effort to
help him make some business connections. I got to have two meals
with Jorge in southern California, while there. I even got to
exchange thoughts about U.S. Immigrations issues and the new Arizona
law with Charles. Who would have thought that a German guy would
have such a keen understanding of U.S. politics and social policies?
On top of that, I got a bunch of supportive emails from all the
players when I went through my medical challenges. All that was far
more important to me than counting how many centers I had at any
given moment in the game."

O - "Fair enough, but what about the
game itself? Surely you gave it some thought as it progressed?"

H - "Jeez, do you really expect me to
remember that stuff? Well, I'll give it a try. Being England, and
starting with just two centers ..."

O - "How did you end up playing
England?"

H - "Oh, when the game started, I
told Charles that I didn't really care which power I got. When I got
England I realized that I needed to do some fancy footwork if I was
going to avoid being eliminated right away. (See, I do care about
the 'game proper' at some level.) My thought was to do what I could
to get Denmark and Sweden to attack each other, in order to give me
some breathing space. Even though I failed (they seemed determined
to be allies) I was able to pick up Ire and Sco. In large part that
was because I trusted France when he offered to make ENG a DMZ. In
many ways that set the stage for the rest of the game. I proclaimed
to the world that England was neutral, while all the while doing what
I could to aide the covert(?) FSE alliance. As things progressed,
France and Spain were very active in trying to coordinate their
forces in the battle for central and southern Europe. I did my best
to stay out of trouble, and continue the charade of my neutrality."

O - "Do you really think you were
able to fool people on that one?"

H - "For a while I think it worked.
Eventually it must have become clear to Jorge that my 'northern
advancement' was aimed at flanking PTA. In any case I'm sure that he
became increasingly frustrated with me as the game advanced. He kept
urging me to attack France, warning that if I did not France would
eventually attack me. Although I wasn't certain that I would
eventually face a French stab, it did seem likely. However, I chose
to not stab France. I thought that to do so would only benefit
Poland, and that I would be caught in a vise, attacked by both France
and Poland. I wasn't sure whether Nigs would honor our alliance, but
I felt that however slight the possibility, it was a better outcome
than the otherwise certainty of being sandwiched between Poland and
France."

O - "And once the stab did come, did
you have regrets about not stabbing first?"

H - "Not for a moment. My only
regret was that I was going to have to eventually deal with Jorge's
'told you so' comments. By the way, to his real credit he said not a
word about it at our dinner in Los Angeles. As a side note, the
highlight of the meal came almost at the end when a brief discussion
of Diplomacy did come up. Catie, Jorge's most impressive girlfriend,
suddenly realized the Diplomacy connection and said, 'Oh, you're that
Harvey!'. I'm still not sure whether I should have been ashamed or
proud to have been identified."

O - "You can't really tell me that
you have no negative feelings about Nigs' stab?"

H - "I really don't. First, I was
expecting it and was surprised that it didn't come a bit sooner.
More importantly, however, was the offer that Nigs had made before I
went into the hospital for my cardiac procedure. There was a vote
for a DIAS on the table, and both Nigs and Dirk offered to vote for
it in order to end the game and 'spare me' from having to think about
the situation while dealing with medical issues. I thanked them, but
asked them to not vote for the DIAS, and I voted against it."

O - "So, no regrets at all?"

H - "A few. First, that I didn't
really establish relationships with the other players. More
importantly, there were several points in the last three or four
months when I found myself (very uncharacteristically) depressed due
to my medical situation. The impact was that I lost virtually all
interest in the game, and lacked the energy to even force myself to
be an active participant in the game. That was unfair to the rest of
the players. I'm most grateful, however, for the support that got
from everyone, Charles included."

O - "And now?"

H - "If truth be told, I'm going to
'hang up my rock and roll shoes' for a while and take a hiatus from
playing Diplomacy. I don't know if it will be weeks or months. It's
happened before - after a year or two playing multiple games
simultaneously I get burned out. But sooner or later the itch comes
back. I'm sure it will again. In the meantime, many thanks to all -
for the challenge, for the support, for the encouragement and for the
friendship!"
1648 - hmtucaz   (Aug 24, 2010, 12:03 pm)
About 10 days from now I head off for a holiday and won't be back home until the end of September.  I don't know if any else plans to do End of Game Statements, but I have one that I actually wrote almost three months ago.  It assumed that I would be eliminated, and at that time I had no real sense of who the winner (or winners) might be.



Below is what I wrote.  I have not altered it since then.

Best Wishes to All,
Harvey


END OF GAME STATEMENT - ENGLAND

Harvey - "It feels really great to
have won this game!"

Observer - "Hey, wait a minute. You
didn't win this game. In fact you were eliminated before the game
ended."

H - "Yes, I was eliminated but I
still won.

O - "What the heck are you saying?
--------- won the game.

H - "Oh, I see. They got their
scores improved. But, what does that have to do with winning?"

O - "It's pretty straightforward.
Haven't you even read the Diplomacy rules?"

H - "I understand your confusion.
You assume that all people play the game to beat the other players,
and that determines who wins and who loses. And you're right -
according to view, I didn't win. But that's not the metric I use."

O - "The metric you use? Oh come on!
Is this going to be a 'sour grapes' story?"

H - "I'll let you judge the 'grapes'
part of it. From my perspective, however, the scores on a web site
aren't very important to me. Far more important are the interactions
that I have with the other players. That's what determines whether
or not I've won a particular game. And, in this game I was a real
winner."

O - "By interactions do you mean you
look at your success in stabbing, misleading and outsmarting the
others?"

H - "Nope, not even close. Don't get
me wrong; I'm no saint, and I've done my share of devious stuff.
And, like everyone else I have no objection to eliminating others and
coming out ahead. But that's not winning for me. Instead I measure
my success or failure by the pleasure I gained from getting to know
my fellow players. And in this game I did pretty well. I got to
have a bunch of "off-line" email conversations with Dirk, along
with a couple of extended 'non-game" phone calls in an effort to
help him make some business connections. I got to have two meals
with Jorge in southern California, while there. I even got to
exchange thoughts about U.S. Immigrations issues and the new Arizona
law with Charles. Who would have thought that a German guy would
have such a keen understanding of U.S. politics and social policies?
On top of that, I got a bunch of supportive emails from all the
players when I went through my medical challenges. All that was far
more important to me than counting how many centers I had at any
given moment in the game."

O - "Fair enough, but what about the
game itself? Surely you gave it some thought as it progressed?"

H - "Jeez, do you really expect me to
remember that stuff? Well, I'll give it a try. Being England, and
starting with just two centers ..."

O - "How did you end up playing
England?"

H - "Oh, when the game started, I
told Charles that I didn't really care which power I got. When I got
England I realized that I needed to do some fancy footwork if I was
going to avoid being eliminated right away. (See, I do care about
the 'game proper' at some level.) My thought was to do what I could
to get Denmark and Sweden to attack each other, in order to give me
some breathing space. Even though I failed (they seemed determined
to be allies) I was able to pick up Ire and Sco. In large part that
was because I trusted France when he offered to make ENG a DMZ. In
many ways that set the stage for the rest of the game. I proclaimed
to the world that England was neutral, while all the while doing what
I could to aide the covert(?) FSE alliance. As things progressed,
France and Spain were very active in trying to coordinate their
forces in the battle for central and southern Europe. I did my best
to stay out of trouble, and continue the charade of my neutrality."

O - "Do you really think you were
able to fool people on that one?"

H - "For a while I think it worked.
Eventually it must have become clear to Jorge that my 'northern
advancement' was aimed at flanking PTA. In any case I'm sure that he
became increasingly frustrated with me as the game advanced. He kept
urging me to attack France, warning that if I did not France would
eventually attack me. Although I wasn't certain that I would
eventually face a French stab, it did seem likely. However, I chose
to not stab France. I thought that to do so would only benefit
Poland, and that I would be caught in a vise, attacked by both France
and Poland. I wasn't sure whether Nigs would honor our alliance, but
I felt that however slight the possibility, it was a better outcome
than the otherwise certainty of being sandwiched between Poland and
France."

O - "And once the stab did come, did
you have regrets about not stabbing first?"

H - "Not for a moment. My only
regret was that I was going to have to eventually deal with Jorge's
'told you so' comments. By the way, to his real credit he said not a
word about it at our dinner in Los Angeles. As a side note, the
highlight of the meal came almost at the end when a brief discussion
of Diplomacy did come up. Catie, Jorge's most impressive girlfriend,
suddenly realized the Diplomacy connection and said, 'Oh, you're that
Harvey!'. I'm still not sure whether I should have been ashamed or
proud to have been identified."

O - "You can't really tell me that
you have no negative feelings about Nigs' stab?"

H - "I really don't. First, I was
expecting it and was surprised that it didn't come a bit sooner.
More importantly, however, was the offer that Nigs had made before I
went into the hospital for my cardiac procedure. There was a vote
for a DIAS on the table, and both Nigs and Dirk offered to vote for
it in order to end the game and 'spare me' from having to think about
the situation while dealing with medical issues. I thanked them, but
asked them to not vote for the DIAS, and I voted against it."

O - "So, no regrets at all?"

H - "A few. First, that I didn't
really establish relationships with the other players. More
importantly, there were several points in the last three or four
months when I found myself (very uncharacteristically) depressed due
to my medical situation. The impact was that I lost virtually all
interest in the game, and lacked the energy to even force myself to
be an active participant in the game. That was unfair to the rest of
the players. I'm most grateful, however, for the support that got
from everyone, Charles included."

O - "And now?"

H - "If truth be told, I'm going to
'hang up my rock and roll shoes' for a while and take a hiatus from
playing Diplomacy. I don't know if it will be weeks or months. It's
happened before - after a year or two playing multiple games
simultaneously I get burned out. But sooner or later the itch comes
back. I'm sure it will again. In the meantime, many thanks to all -
for the challenge, for the support, for the encouragement and for the
friendship!"

[Reply]

1648 - hmtucaz   (Aug 20, 2010, 7:16 pm)
I, too, take it as a given that the draw passed.  Congratulations to Poland, Turkey and France.

Fini.

Harvey

2010/8/20 Jorge Saralegui <jmsaralegui(at)gmail.com>

Hi guys,
I assume the draw passed.  If it didn't, I won't be hanging around for the next round.  Thanks to all the players for giving the game the respect that it deserved.


Cheers,
Jorge

#avg_ls_inline_popup { position:absolute; z-index:9999; padding: 0px 0px; margin-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; width: 240px; overflow: hidden; word-wrap: break-word; color: black; font-size: 10px; text-align: left; line-height: 13px;}

[Reply]

1648 - txurce   (Aug 20, 2010, 7:08 pm)
Hi guys,
I assume the draw passed.  If it didn't, I won't be hanging around for the next round.  Thanks to all the players for giving the game the respect that it deserved.

Cheers,
Jorge

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - Lane   (Aug 14, 2010, 2:46 am)
Hi Gents
 
Yes vote filed with Autumn orders. All Turkish units will hold to give
peace a chance.
 
Regards
 
Aidan

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - offdisc   (Aug 13, 2010, 12:55 pm)
I vote YES!
---------
"Sit Long, Talk Much, Laugh Often" -- anon
"Shared Pain is lessened, Shared Joy is increased" --- Spider Robinson




On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 5:16 AM, Nigs <nephilli99(at)hotmail.com> wrote:

So if Mike agrees too we are all done?
Nigs

Sent from my iPhone
On 13 Aug 2010, at 06:33, AiSlattery(at)aol.com wrote:



Hi Gents
 
I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my
prelims.
 
Regards
 
Aidan
 
 

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - hmtucaz   (Aug 13, 2010, 11:21 am)
I've explicitly stated my vote in my prelims (well, actually, in an addendum to my prelims).

Harvey

On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 9:02 AM, Jorge Saralegui <jmsaralegui(at)gmail.com> wrote:

Let's keep in mind that we have to file prelims as well as vote in

them to make this official.



Jorge



On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 4:16 AM, Nigs <nephilli99(at)hotmail.com> wrote:

> So if Mike agrees too we are all done?

> Nigs

>

> Sent from my iPhone

> On 13 Aug 2010, at 06:33, AiSlattery(at)aol.com wrote:

>

> Hi Gents

>

> I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my

> prelims.

>

> Regards

>

> Aidan

>

>

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - txurce   (Aug 13, 2010, 11:02 am)
Let's keep in mind that we have to file prelims as well as vote in
them to make this official.
Jorge
On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 4:16 AM, Nigs wrote:
So if Mike agrees too we are all done?
Nigs

Sent from my iPhone
On 13 Aug 2010, at 06:33, AiSlattery(at)aol.com wrote:

Hi Gents

I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my
prelims.

Regards

Aidan

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - Nigs   (Aug 13, 2010, 6:16 am)
So if Mike agrees too we are all done?
Nigs

Sent from my iPhone
On 13 Aug 2010, at 06:33, AiSlattery(at)aol.com wrote:


Hi Gents
 
I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my
prelims.
 
Regards
 
Aidan
 
 

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - Lane   (Aug 13, 2010, 12:33 am)
Hi Gents
 
I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my
prelims.
 
Regards
 
Aidan
 
 

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - hmtucaz   (Aug 12, 2010, 5:16 pm)
And you all know where I stand.  Let's get this over; I leave on holiday shortly and won't have regular internet access.

Harvey

On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 2:54 PM, Dirk Knemeyer <dirk(at)knemeyer.com> wrote:

I've already voted yes.

On Aug 12, 2010, at 5:44 PM, Nigel PHILLIPS wrote:

I'd vote yes.
Nigs

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - dknemeyer   (Aug 12, 2010, 4:54 pm)
I've already voted yes.
On Aug 12, 2010, at 5:44 PM, Nigel PHILLIPS wrote:
I'd vote yes.
Nigs

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - Nigs   (Aug 12, 2010, 4:44 pm)
I'd vote yes.
Nigs

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - txurce   (Aug 12, 2010, 4:20 pm)
Hi Charles,
Could we vote for the FPT draw with our prelims, so we'd have a
decision by Monday - possibly ending the game before the fall turn is
played out? I can think of several players who would prefer that.
Thanks, Jorge
2010/8/12 Charles Féaux de la Croix :
Guys,

I'm afraid I failed to note that the FPT three-way draw proposal has once
again been put on the table.

Why is it always that one remembers stuff only when pressing the SEND
button? Or is it just me? Hm, probably...

Cheers,

Charles

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum - charlesf   (Aug 12, 2010, 3:19 pm)
Guys,
 
I'm afraid I failed to note that the FPT three-way
draw proposal has once again been put on the table.
 
Why is it always that one remembers stuff only when
pressing the SEND button? Or is it just me? Hm, probably...
 
Cheers,
 
Charles

[Reply]

1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) txurce Aug 12, 04:20 pm
Hi Charles,
Could we vote for the FPT draw with our prelims, so we'd have a
decision by Monday - possibly ending the game before the fall turn is
played out? I can think of several players who would prefer that.
Thanks, Jorge
2010/8/12 Charles Féaux de la Croix :
Guys,

I'm afraid I failed to note that the FPT three-way draw proposal has once
again been put on the table.

Why is it always that one remembers stuff only when pressing the SEND
button? Or is it just me? Hm, probably...

Cheers,

Charles
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) Nigs Aug 12, 04:44 pm
I'd vote yes.
Nigs
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) dknemeyer Aug 12, 04:54 pm
I've already voted yes.
On Aug 12, 2010, at 5:44 PM, Nigel PHILLIPS wrote:
I'd vote yes.
Nigs
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) hmtucaz Aug 12, 05:16 pm
And you all know where I stand.  Let's get this over; I leave on holiday shortly and won't have regular internet access.

Harvey

On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 2:54 PM, Dirk Knemeyer <dirk(at)knemeyer.com> wrote:

I've already voted yes.

On Aug 12, 2010, at 5:44 PM, Nigel PHILLIPS wrote:

I'd vote yes.
Nigs
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) Lane Aug 13, 12:33 am
Hi Gents
 
I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my
prelims.
 
Regards
 
Aidan
 
 
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) Nigs Aug 13, 06:16 am
So if Mike agrees too we are all done?
Nigs

Sent from my iPhone
On 13 Aug 2010, at 06:33, AiSlattery(at)aol.com wrote:


Hi Gents
 
I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my
prelims.
 
Regards
 
Aidan
 
 
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) txurce Aug 13, 11:02 am
Let's keep in mind that we have to file prelims as well as vote in
them to make this official.
Jorge
On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 4:16 AM, Nigs wrote:
So if Mike agrees too we are all done?
Nigs

Sent from my iPhone
On 13 Aug 2010, at 06:33, AiSlattery(at)aol.com wrote:

Hi Gents

I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my
prelims.

Regards

Aidan
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) hmtucaz Aug 13, 11:21 am
I've explicitly stated my vote in my prelims (well, actually, in an addendum to my prelims).

Harvey

On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 9:02 AM, Jorge Saralegui <jmsaralegui(at)gmail.com> wrote:

Let's keep in mind that we have to file prelims as well as vote in

them to make this official.



Jorge



On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 4:16 AM, Nigs <nephilli99(at)hotmail.com> wrote:

> So if Mike agrees too we are all done?

> Nigs

>

> Sent from my iPhone

> On 13 Aug 2010, at 06:33, AiSlattery(at)aol.com wrote:

>

> Hi Gents

>

> I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my

> prelims.

>

> Regards

>

> Aidan

>

>
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) offdisc Aug 13, 12:55 pm
I vote YES!
---------
"Sit Long, Talk Much, Laugh Often" -- anon
"Shared Pain is lessened, Shared Joy is increased" --- Spider Robinson




On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 5:16 AM, Nigs <nephilli99(at)hotmail.com> wrote:

So if Mike agrees too we are all done?
Nigs

Sent from my iPhone
On 13 Aug 2010, at 06:33, AiSlattery(at)aol.com wrote:



Hi Gents
 
I proposed the 3-way and will also vote to put the game to bed with my
prelims.
 
Regards
 
Aidan
 
 
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - Addendum (dc279) Lane Aug 14, 02:46 am
Hi Gents
 
Yes vote filed with Autumn orders. All Turkish units will hold to give
peace a chance.
 
Regards
 
Aidan
1648 (dc279) txurce Aug 20, 07:08 pm
Hi guys,
I assume the draw passed.  If it didn't, I won't be hanging around for the next round.  Thanks to all the players for giving the game the respect that it deserved.

Cheers,
Jorge
1648 (dc279) hmtucaz Aug 20, 07:16 pm
I, too, take it as a given that the draw passed.  Congratulations to Poland, Turkey and France.

Fini.

Harvey

2010/8/20 Jorge Saralegui <jmsaralegui(at)gmail.com>

Hi guys,
I assume the draw passed.  If it didn't, I won't be hanging around for the next round.  Thanks to all the players for giving the game the respect that it deserved.


Cheers,
Jorge

#avg_ls_inline_popup { position:absolute; z-index:9999; padding: 0px 0px; margin-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; width: 240px; overflow: hidden; word-wrap: break-word; color: black; font-size: 10px; text-align: left; line-height: 13px;}
1648 (dc279) hmtucaz Aug 24, 12:03 pm
About 10 days from now I head off for a holiday and won't be back home until the end of September.  I don't know if any else plans to do End of Game Statements, but I have one that I actually wrote almost three months ago.  It assumed that I would be eliminated, and at that time I had no real sense of who the winner (or winners) might be.



Below is what I wrote.  I have not altered it since then.

Best Wishes to All,
Harvey


END OF GAME STATEMENT - ENGLAND

Harvey - "It feels really great to
have won this game!"

Observer - "Hey, wait a minute. You
didn't win this game. In fact you were eliminated before the game
ended."

H - "Yes, I was eliminated but I
still won.

O - "What the heck are you saying?
--------- won the game.

H - "Oh, I see. They got their
scores improved. But, what does that have to do with winning?"

O - "It's pretty straightforward.
Haven't you even read the Diplomacy rules?"

H - "I understand your confusion.
You assume that all people play the game to beat the other players,
and that determines who wins and who loses. And you're right -
according to view, I didn't win. But that's not the metric I use."

O - "The metric you use? Oh come on!
Is this going to be a 'sour grapes' story?"

H - "I'll let you judge the 'grapes'
part of it. From my perspective, however, the scores on a web site
aren't very important to me. Far more important are the interactions
that I have with the other players. That's what determines whether
or not I've won a particular game. And, in this game I was a real
winner."

O - "By interactions do you mean you
look at your success in stabbing, misleading and outsmarting the
others?"

H - "Nope, not even close. Don't get
me wrong; I'm no saint, and I've done my share of devious stuff.
And, like everyone else I have no objection to eliminating others and
coming out ahead. But that's not winning for me. Instead I measure
my success or failure by the pleasure I gained from getting to know
my fellow players. And in this game I did pretty well. I got to
have a bunch of "off-line" email conversations with Dirk, along
with a couple of extended 'non-game" phone calls in an effort to
help him make some business connections. I got to have two meals
with Jorge in southern California, while there. I even got to
exchange thoughts about U.S. Immigrations issues and the new Arizona
law with Charles. Who would have thought that a German guy would
have such a keen understanding of U.S. politics and social policies?
On top of that, I got a bunch of supportive emails from all the
players when I went through my medical challenges. All that was far
more important to me than counting how many centers I had at any
given moment in the game."

O - "Fair enough, but what about the
game itself? Surely you gave it some thought as it progressed?"

H - "Jeez, do you really expect me to
remember that stuff? Well, I'll give it a try. Being England, and
starting with just two centers ..."

O - "How did you end up playing
England?"

H - "Oh, when the game started, I
told Charles that I didn't really care which power I got. When I got
England I realized that I needed to do some fancy footwork if I was
going to avoid being eliminated right away. (See, I do care about
the 'game proper' at some level.) My thought was to do what I could
to get Denmark and Sweden to attack each other, in order to give me
some breathing space. Even though I failed (they seemed determined
to be allies) I was able to pick up Ire and Sco. In large part that
was because I trusted France when he offered to make ENG a DMZ. In
many ways that set the stage for the rest of the game. I proclaimed
to the world that England was neutral, while all the while doing what
I could to aide the covert(?) FSE alliance. As things progressed,
France and Spain were very active in trying to coordinate their
forces in the battle for central and southern Europe. I did my best
to stay out of trouble, and continue the charade of my neutrality."

O - "Do you really think you were
able to fool people on that one?"

H - "For a while I think it worked.
Eventually it must have become clear to Jorge that my 'northern
advancement' was aimed at flanking PTA. In any case I'm sure that he
became increasingly frustrated with me as the game advanced. He kept
urging me to attack France, warning that if I did not France would
eventually attack me. Although I wasn't certain that I would
eventually face a French stab, it did seem likely. However, I chose
to not stab France. I thought that to do so would only benefit
Poland, and that I would be caught in a vise, attacked by both France
and Poland. I wasn't sure whether Nigs would honor our alliance, but
I felt that however slight the possibility, it was a better outcome
than the otherwise certainty of being sandwiched between Poland and
France."

O - "And once the stab did come, did
you have regrets about not stabbing first?"

H - "Not for a moment. My only
regret was that I was going to have to eventually deal with Jorge's
'told you so' comments. By the way, to his real credit he said not a
word about it at our dinner in Los Angeles. As a side note, the
highlight of the meal came almost at the end when a brief discussion
of Diplomacy did come up. Catie, Jorge's most impressive girlfriend,
suddenly realized the Diplomacy connection and said, 'Oh, you're that
Harvey!'. I'm still not sure whether I should have been ashamed or
proud to have been identified."

O - "You can't really tell me that
you have no negative feelings about Nigs' stab?"

H - "I really don't. First, I was
expecting it and was surprised that it didn't come a bit sooner.
More importantly, however, was the offer that Nigs had made before I
went into the hospital for my cardiac procedure. There was a vote
for a DIAS on the table, and both Nigs and Dirk offered to vote for
it in order to end the game and 'spare me' from having to think about
the situation while dealing with medical issues. I thanked them, but
asked them to not vote for the DIAS, and I voted against it."

O - "So, no regrets at all?"

H - "A few. First, that I didn't
really establish relationships with the other players. More
importantly, there were several points in the last three or four
months when I found myself (very uncharacteristically) depressed due
to my medical situation. The impact was that I lost virtually all
interest in the game, and lacked the energy to even force myself to
be an active participant in the game. That was unfair to the rest of
the players. I'm most grateful, however, for the support that got
from everyone, Charles included."

O - "And now?"

H - "If truth be told, I'm going to
'hang up my rock and roll shoes' for a while and take a hiatus from
playing Diplomacy. I don't know if it will be weeks or months. It's
happened before - after a year or two playing multiple games
simultaneously I get burned out. But sooner or later the itch comes
back. I'm sure it will again. In the meantime, many thanks to all -
for the challenge, for the support, for the encouragement and for the
friendship!"
1648 091010: Spring 1662 Moves - charlesf   (Aug 12, 2010, 2:32 pm)
 
Hallo zusammen,
 
the new year has opened with the good citizens of several regions (5
SCs) having to supply new arrivals. We shall see in the fall how this game of
musical chairs will pan out.
 
The Fall 1662 deadline is set for next Wednesday, 18 August.
 
Cheers,
 
Charles
 

----------
PLAYERS:
    AUSTRIA: Mike Hoffman <mrh(at)panix.com>
    DENMARK-NORWAY: Marc
Ellinger <mellinger(at)blitzbardgett.com> (eliminated Winter
1653)
    ENGLAND: Harvey Morris <hmtucaz(at)gmail.com>
    FRANCE: Nigel Phillips <nephilli99(at)hotmail.com>
    POLAND-LITHUANIA: Jorge
Saralegui <jmsaralegui(at)gmail.com>
    RUSSIA: Mikael Johansson <m_don_j(at)hotmail.com> (eliminated Winter 1650)
    SPAIN: Dirk Knemeyer <dirk(at)knemeyer.com>
    SWEDEN: Matthew Kelly
<kelly058(at)verizon.net> (joined Winter 1652, eliminated Fall
165Cool
    TURKEY: Aidan
Slattery <AiSlattery(at)aol.com>

PROCLAMATIONS:
    o EUROPE'S SUPERPOWERS JOSTLE FOR POSITION

PRESS: None. Sad
 
ORDERS:
 
Austria:
A Prague Supports A Vienna
A Switzerland - Savoy
A
Vienna Supports A Prague
 
England:
F Ireland Hold
 
France:
A Bavaria Hold
F Bristol - English Channel
F English
Channel - Cantabrian Sea
F Flanders - Normandy (*Fails*)
A Lombardy
Supports A Switzerland - Savoy
A London Hold
A Lorraine Supports A
Paris
A Paris Supports F Flanders - Normandy (*Cut*)
A
Rhineland-Westphalia - Lower Saxony
F Scotland - Ireland (*Fails*)
A
Swabia - Switzerland
 
Poland-Lithuania:
A Abo - Karelia
F Copenhagen Hold
A Courland
Hold
A Cracow Hold
A Lower Saxony - Hesse
F Mecklenburg - Bay of
Luebeck
A Moscow - Astrakhan (*Bounce*)
F North Sea Supports F Bristol -
English Channel
F Norwegian Sea - North Atlantic Ocean
A Prussia Hold
A
Saxony Supports A Bavaria
A Slovakia Supports A Transylvania
A
Transylvania Hold
A Turkestan - Astrakhan (*Bounce*)
A Vilna Hold
A
Warsaw Hold
A White Ruthenia - Voronezh
 
Spain:
F Brest Supports F Normandy
A Dauphiné - Paris (*Fails*)
A
Gascony Supports A Dauphiné - Paris
F Normandy Supports F Brest (*Cut*)
F
Savoy - Marseilles
 
Turkey:
F Adriatic Sea Supports F Venice
A Belgrade - Wallachia
A
Constantinople - Bulgaria
A Crimea Hold
A Damascus - Azerbaijan
A
Hungary Supports A Belgrade - Wallachia
F Moldavia - Black Sea
F Morocco
Hold
A Papal States Supports F Venice
A Persia - Turkestan (*Fails*)
F
Seville - Portugal
F Trieste Supports F Venice
A Tuscany Supports A
Switzerland - Savoy
A Ukraine Supports A Wallachia - Moldavia (*Fails*)
F
Venice Supports F Trieste
A Voronezh - Armenia
A Wallachia - Moldavia
F
Western Mediterranean - Seville
 
PENDING RETREATS:
 
None.
 
SUPPLY CENTER OWNERSHIP
(Winter 1661):



 
Austria(5-2=3): -Bavaria-, Prague, Switzerland, -Venice-,
Vienna.
England(4-3=1): -Abo-, -Bristol-, Ireland,
-London-.
France(12+3-4=11): +Bavaria+, +Bristol+, -Copenhagen-, Flanders,
Holstein, +London+, Lorraine, -Lower Saxony-, -Mecklenburg-,
Paris, Rhineland-Westphalia, -Saxony-, Scotland, Swabia, United
Provinces.
Poland-Lithuania(14+6-1=19): +Abo+, Brandenburg, Christiania,
+Copenhagen+, Courland, Cracow, +Lower Saxony+, +Mecklenburg+, Moscow, Novgorod,
Prussia, Riga, +Saxony+, Stettin, Stockholm, +Transylvania+, Turkestan, Vilna,
-Voronezh-, Warsaw.
Spain(7-2=5): Brest, Madrid, Marseilles, -Morocco-,
Portugal, Savoy, -Seville-.
Turkey(16+4-1=19): Algiers, Belgrade,
Candia, Constantinople, Crimea, Damascus, Moldavia, +Morocco+, Naples,
Papal States, Persia, +Seville+, -Transylvania-, Trieste, Tunis, Tuscany,
Ukraine, +Venice+, +Voronezh+, Wallachia.

DEADLINE SCHEDULE: (all orders
are due NLT 6PM CET (i.e. GMT+1)...not local
time)

    o Fall 1662 Moves: (16) 18 August
 
ORDERS MAP:
 
RESULTS MAP:

[Reply]

1648 091010: Winter 1661 Retreats/Adjustments - charlesf   (Aug 02, 2010, 7:19 pm)
 
Hallo zusammen,
 
okay, we're finally moving forward. Though given the holiday season, we
shall continue to move on at a leisurely pace.
 
And yes - as you may have inferred from the first sentence - we are
moving on since the submitted FPT three-way draw proposal failed.
 
Armies have been en vogue this winter, with both Warsaw and the Porte
churning them out in record numbers, though of course neither monarch was able
to build to his full potential owing to limited build sites. With both of these
two "superpowers" having exceeded the victory criterion, will one of the two
manage to edge past the other in the coming year?
 
The spring 1662 deadline is now scheduled for Wednesday, 11 August. Seemed
to me the best solution given that Nigs will only have very restricted email
access for the remainder of his holidays.
 
Charles
 

----------
PLAYERS:
    AUSTRIA: Mike Hoffman <mrh(at)panix.com>
    DENMARK-NORWAY: Marc
Ellinger <mellinger(at)blitzbardgett.com> (eliminated Winter
1653)
    ENGLAND: Harvey Morris <hmtucaz(at)gmail.com>
    FRANCE: Nigel Phillips <nephilli99(at)hotmail.com>
    POLAND-LITHUANIA: Jorge
Saralegui <jmsaralegui(at)gmail.com>
    RUSSIA: Mikael Johansson <m_don_j(at)hotmail.com> (eliminated Winter 1650)
    SPAIN: Dirk Knemeyer <dirk(at)knemeyer.com>
    SWEDEN: Matthew Kelly
<kelly058(at)verizon.net> (joined Winter 1652, eliminated Fall
165Cool
    TURKEY: Aidan
Slattery <AiSlattery(at)aol.com>

PROCLAMATIONS:
    o ARCHDUKE DISBANDS TYROLIAN LEVY
    o ROUNDHEARD DIE-HARDS HOLD OUT IN IRELAND
    o EMPEROR SEEKS TO HOLD ON TO THE "IRON CROWN" OF ITALY,
WHILE FURTHER RELINQUISHING HIS HOLD ON NORTHERN GERMANY
    o POLISH LEVIES OF RAW RECRUITS ASSEMBLE THROUGHOUT THE
REALM
    o SULTAN CALLS HIS SUBJECTS TO ARMS

PRESS: None. Sad
 
RETREATS:
 
France:
A Savoy - Lombardy
 
Poland-Lithuania:
A Voronezh - White Ruthenia
 
ADJUSTMENTS:
 
Austria:
Remove A Tyrolia
 
England:
Remove A Devon
Remove F Irish Sea
 
France:
Remove A Holstein
 
Poland-Lithuania:
Build A Cracow
Build A Prussia
Build A
Courland
 
Spain:
Remove F North Atlantic Ocean
 
Turkey:
Build A Belgrade
Build A Constantinople
Build A
Damascus
 
SUPPLY CENTER OWNERSHIP
(Winter 1661):



 
Austria(5-2=3): -Bavaria-, Prague, Switzerland, -Venice-,
Vienna.
England(4-3=1): -Abo-, -Bristol-, Ireland,
-London-.
France(12+3-4=11): +Bavaria+, +Bristol+, -Copenhagen-, Flanders,
Holstein, +London+, Lorraine, -Lower Saxony-, -Mecklenburg-,
Paris, Rhineland-Westphalia, -Saxony-, Scotland, Swabia, United
Provinces.
Poland-Lithuania(14+6-1=19): +Abo+, Brandenburg, Christiania,
+Copenhagen+, Courland, Cracow, +Lower Saxony+, +Mecklenburg+, Moscow, Novgorod,
Prussia, Riga, +Saxony+, Stettin, Stockholm, +Transylvania+, Turkestan, Vilna,
-Voronezh-, Warsaw.
Spain(7-2=5): Brest, Madrid, Marseilles, -Morocco-,
Portugal, Savoy, -Seville-.
Turkey(16+4-1=19): Algiers, Belgrade,
Candia, Constantinople, Crimea, Damascus, Moldavia, +Morocco+, Naples,
Papal States, Persia, +Seville+, -Transylvania-, Trieste, Tunis, Tuscany,
Ukraine, +Venice+, +Voronezh+, Wallachia.

DEADLINE SCHEDULE: (all orders
are due NLT 6PM CET (i.e. GMT+1)...not local
time)

    o Spring 1662 Moves: (9) 11 August
 
MAP:

[Reply]

1648 091010: Game Status - charlesf   (Jul 29, 2010, 10:54 am)
Hi guys,
 
please apologise the longer absence of your GM. I'm
still in Greece as we extended our stay here both in order to avoid the strike
waves here in Greece impeding our travel home and also since we wanted to extend
our stay here anyway. Given changed plans, being on a yacht or in countryside
unfortunately meant "no internet" and hence only now I'm able to catch up on
Diplo-matters, being back in the capital. In hindsight, I ought to have not
overoptimistically attempted to schedule a deadline during my holiday. Live and
learn. In any case, I'm flying back home tomorrow morning.
 
As my inbox filled up, I may have missed a set of
orders. I'll shortly confirm all orders I've received. Should you not receive a
confirmation of your latest orders shortly, please resend. On account of this
issue, I'm rescheduling the coming winter deadline for Monday, 6PM.
 
Greetings from Athens,
 
Charles

[Reply]

Page:   1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8 

Rows per page:

Diplomacy games may contain lying, stabbing, or deliberately deceiving communications that may not be suitable for and may pose a hazard to young children, gullible adults, and small farm animals.

Powered by Fuzzy Logic · You are visitor number 55604 · Page loaded in 0.8163 seconds by DESMOND